Do we envisage milkyway@home being able to run on these cards as I'm intending to sell up and jump to 47xx.
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Edited. Was speaking a load of crap :)
(And I've got a couple of 4670s lying around which I can't use. Trying to sell them to get a 4850 =P)
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On a side note, the 4890s just got released on Overclockers.co.uk today :) 210GBP is the cheapest, though.
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Only x8xx cards are being supported, as they support double precision. This project relies on double precision accuracy, that x7xx cards do not provide. I made a thread about the issues of single vs. double precision here : http://milkyway.cs.rpi.edu/milkyway/forum_thread.php?id=764
I don't know how that stands against the HD4770 though. Reputed performance puts it above the HD4830 and almost to the HD4850. It comes with GDDR5 memory as well. If those stats are indicative of anything, it may well be capable of double-precision.
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Good point. The 4770 uses the RV740 chip, which is essentially the 40nm version of the RV770LE, which is used in 4830s. The 4770 core speed is 800Mhz, between the 4850 and 4870, however only has 640 cores compared to the 800 of the 48xx series.
I couldn't find anything conclusive on whether the 47xx series was double capable or not (my initial assumption was on the fact that 46/47 series is designated 'high consumer end' and 48/49 is 'high performance end'). I did however find a post by Gipsel on the AMD forums asking this question back on 10th Feb.
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I couldn't find anything conclusive on whether the 47xx series was double capable or not (my initial assumption was on the fact that 46/47 series is designated 'high consumer end' and 48/49 is 'high performance end'). I did however find a post by Gipsel on the AMD forums asking this question back on 10th Feb.
Yes, I asked this. But as they don't comment on future products, I don't know either.
But the 4890 is compatible for sure. The relative crunching speed should be the same as I speculated a month ago.
When neglecting the 1-2 seconds CPU calculation for every WU (which is justified if you have two or more concurrent WUs running), one can break it down to the following performance relations (taking the HD3850 as base):
3850 : 3870 : 4830 : 4850 : 4870 : 4890 : 4890 OC (900MHz) : 4890 OC (1GHz, appears to be realistic with a good card)
1 : 1.16 : 1.72 : 2.33 : 2.80 : 3.17 : 3.36 : 3.73
Of course the ratios only applies for stock clocks (670MHz for 3850, 775MHz for 3870, 575MHz for 4830, 625MHz for 4850, 750MHz for 4870 and 850MHz for 4890 with the memory speed only a very minor factor). The performance scales linearly with GPU clock speed.
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But the 4890 is compatible for sure. The relative crunching speed should be the same as I speculated a month ago.
Has the HD4890 been tested as working? Has anyone got it working yet? Does it perform better than the HD4870 for MW crunching?
Has anyone found any MW WUs to test it on?
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But the 4890 is compatible for sure. The relative crunching speed should be the same as I speculated a month ago.
Has the HD4890 been tested as working? Has anyone got it working yet? Does it perform better than the HD4870 for MW crunching?
Has anyone found any MW WUs to test it on?
I am sure you have seen the discussion started by PoorBoy in this other thread, your one, Ice. He seems to be the first to try one of the new HD4890's, and is running in to a bit of difficulty getting the card to run MW.
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But the 4890 is compatible for sure. The relative crunching speed should be the same as I speculated a month ago.
Has the HD4890 been tested as working? Has anyone got it working yet? Does it perform better than the HD4870 for MW crunching?
Has anyone found any MW WUs to test it on?
I am sure you have seen the discussion started by PoorBoy in this other thread, your one, Ice. He seems to be the first to try one of the new HD4890's, and is running in to a bit of difficulty getting the card to run MW.
Yes John Clark, I have seen the discussion in my own thread. Your stating the obvious remains unabated. In my post that you quote above Cluster Physik says 'in this thread' that that "the 4890 is compatible for sure", and my web site zslip.com reflected this until this morning, when I changed it to say it does not work with the HD4890. Poorboy has indicated that he can't get his to work, but I ask in this thread with "HD4890" in the title whether anyone has got this new card to work with the ATI optimized apps, so that I can keep my website zslip.com up to date.
So I ask again, not what poorboy is doing or whether I read my own threads, but "has anyone got the HD4890 working with the optimized apps?"
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So I ask again, not what poorboy is doing or whether I read my own threads, but "has anyone got the HD4890 working with the optimized apps?"
I would wait until the correct drivers are released. The problem at the moment seems to be that the available drivers (Cats 9.3) don't support the 4890. The 9.4s (to be released today?) should.
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The BOINC FAQ Service.
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Sorry guy's, I didn't notice this Thread or I would have Posted my Problem's with the 4890 here instead of where I did. The 9.4 Drivers aren't out yet as I just checked again. I left the 4890 Card in the Computer even though it wasn't doing anything but so I could try the new drivers as soon as I notice that they are out. If the new Drivers don't work I'll pull it then and put the 4870 back in.
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Sorry guy's, I didn't notice this Thread or I would have Posted my Problem's with the 4890 here instead of where I did. The 9.4 Drivers aren't out yet as I just checked again. I left the 4890 Card in the Computer even though it wasn't doing anything but so I could try the new drivers as soon as I notice that they are out. If the new Drivers don't work I'll pull it then and put the 4870 back in.
Never mind, the thread you chose seemed, on the face of it, appropriate at the time, so I wouldn't feel out of sorts. Just be aware that Ice takes a poor view of anyone posting the obvious, to him, even when it is posted on the assumption it may have been missed and is directly connected to the question he asked earlier.
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Sorry guy's, I didn't notice this Thread or I would have Posted my Problem's with the 4890 here instead of where I did. The 9.4 Drivers aren't out yet as I just checked again. I left the 4890 Card in the Computer even though it wasn't doing anything but so I could try the new drivers as soon as I notice that they are out. If the new Drivers don't work I'll pull it then and put the 4870 back in.
Never mind, the thread you chose seemed, on the face of it, appropriate at the time, so I wouldn't feel out of sorts. Just be aware that Ice takes a poor view of anyone posting the obvious, to him, even when it is posted on the assumption it may have been missed and is directly connected to the question he asked earlier.
No John Clark, I just take a dim view of you posting your usual drivel which has nothing to do with anything that helps.
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To play it safe, either splurge and go for a 48xx, or go [relatively] cheap and get a 38xx, if you can find one.
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With the announcement on the home page of CUDA based clients for the nVidia cards. Is there a consensus on what nVidia cards would run the client, and the best bang for buck (like the HD4850 for ATI and MW).
One advantage the nVidia equivalents for MW would have over the ATI HDxxx Radeons will be the ability to run more projects than just MW.
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Is there a consensus on what nVidia cards would run the client, and the best bang for buck (like the HD4850 for ATI and MW).
I would think the GTX260 has the best performance per $ or € with the new GTX275 coming in at a close second place.
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Is there a consensus on what nVidia cards would run the client, and the best bang for buck (like the HD4850 for ATI and MW).
I would think the GTX260 has the best performance per $ or € with the new GTX275 coming in at a close second place.
Looking as the prices of the Asus GTX260 PCI-E2.0 512MB priced at £175 and the Asus ATI HD4870 512MB also priced at £185 they are similar. Both locally.
Is there an nVidia equivalent in performance and price to the Asus ATI HD4850, locally this is priced at £130? This latter ATI card looks like it is the golden price-performance point.
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Is there an nVidia equivalent in performance and price to the Asus ATI HD4850, locally this is priced at £130? This latter ATI card looks like it is the golden price-performance point.
I picked up my two 4850s (Asus 512MB versions) for £112 each from ebuyer. Takes around 40s for a 30cred WU.
As for ATi vs. nVidia on this project, ATi should get the nod ahead given the increase in double precision speed over nVidia. Correct me if I'm wrong...
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Is there a consensus on what nVidia cards would run the client, and the best bang for buck (like the HD4850 for ATI and MW).
I would think the GTX260 has the best performance per $ or € with the new GTX275 coming in at a close second place.
Looking as the prices of the Asus GTX260 PCI-E2.0 512MB priced at £175 and the Asus ATI HD4870 512MB also priced at £185 they are similar. Both locally.
Is there an nVidia equivalent in performance and price to the Asus ATI HD4850, locally this is priced at £130? This latter ATI card looks like it is the golden price-performance point.
I don't know where you mean by 'locally', but in England at ebuyer.com you can get a ASUS ATI HD4850 for £109.99, and a ASUS ATI HD4870 for £154.38 or a XFX HD4870 for just £149.99, all prices include VAT tax. Even pcworld.co.uk will give you a Sapphire HD4850 for £122.23 including VAT tax.
[edit] I cross posted with borandi. ebuyer is OK, but there are sites where you can get even lower prices - shop around...
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........... Try overclockers.co.uk - they have XFX 260s (55NM, 216 SP ) at £150 inc VAT. 275s are likely to prove the best £/performance - but as of yet supply is still too short in the UK to see some sensible pricing.
£160 should give you a choice of 4870 1Gb cards ..... some sites also have free delivery at this price. You shouldn't be paying more than this for a 4870 any more....
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I did a post on Facebook recently, asking all my friends who build their own (note most of Hull University Computer Society, of which I was Vice-President for two years) where they get their stuff from, just in case I missed a big UK e-tailer. General consensus was Scan, Overclockers, eBuyer, Aria, MicroDirect and Novatech. From those, eBuyer generally had the lower prices, and I've ordered several times at 5pm one night with free super saver 5-day delivery, and got it by 2pm the next day. Though eBuyer have been known to have bad customer support if they screw up your order.
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Is there an nVidia equivalent in performance and price to the Asus ATI HD4850, locally this is priced at £130?
The performance of a GTX295 may come close to that of a HD4850. I guess that answers also the question about the price ;)
That is of course only a guesstimate, depending on the efficiency of the CUDA implementation. Maybe there are some changes to the algorithm with the announced new GPU version that shifts this relation.
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Though eBuyer have been known to have bad customer support if they screw up your order.
Ah yes, I had that knowledge. I got a HD4870 from them which required two internal power leads; with just the one they supplied it didn't work. It took them over 2 weeks to get the second to me. Thankfully I managed to get a lead from Maplins so was able to get crunching straight away.
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Thanks for the considered replies.
The reason I raised the ATI HD48xx versus nVidia GTX26x GPU thing was driven by Travis's home page comments -
we should be meeting with lab staff to get the MilkywayGPU@Home project up and running. I'll also be posting CPU code for the GPU application this afternoon so the people who have made the GPU application for the ATI cards can get their hands on it and modify it so it works with ATI cards. We should have the CUDA code out sometime this week.
This seemed to place an emphasis on CUDA and not the ATI side of things, but I may just be reading in what I might want to see.
One advantage that CUDA holds ATM is the graphic cards can be used on a wider range of projects than the ATI GPUs, which are limited to MW.
In my case I purchased one ATI GPU, for an old AGP slot PC.
With my newer machines, with PCI-E slots, I can now choose either nVidia or ATI, depending on the graphics card software released by Dave and Travis, and what other crunchers post on their experience of application/speed of MW work being crunched.
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nVidia, with CUDA, is well supported and publicised, and are in a better position software wise to be utilised. Hence why more projects support it.
ATi with Stream is getting there. Don't forget, the ATi app here was developed independently by Gipsel/Cluster Physik by rewriting the CPU code and improving efficiency. MilkyWay's code is open source, whereas most other projects aren't, meaning that users of MilkyWay can recompile it for their own machines, or rewrite it for other hardware (like ATi cards).
The CUDA development for MW looks like it will be done by the project staff, whereas the new longer WU side of MW will have it's ATi app done (I presume, if he wants to do it) by Gipsel. All us ATi crunchers, and the project staff too most likely, are very appreciative of his abilities!
In terms of what can be used, one of the reasons MW only uses 38xx and 48xx cards is for double precision. That means, for nVidia, only GTX 2xx cards will be able to run MW. Other CUDA enabled devices will not, as they do not support double precision (like my 4670 cards I have here).
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Is there a consensus on what nVidia cards would run the client, and the best bang for buck (like the HD4850 for ATI and MW).
Someone over at GPUGrid made a list about Credits per €, have a look here. :)
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Member of BOINC@Heidelberg and ATA!
My BOINCstats
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nVidia, with CUDA, is well supported and publicised, and are in a better position software wise to be utilised. Hence why more projects support it.
No, I think what happened was that Nvidia gave the BOINC devs some money and a couple cards to implement CUDA first. Nvidia also wanted it to coincide with a press release from them, which is why BOINC 6.4.x was released in such a sorry state, but with CUDA crunching.
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nVidia, with CUDA, is well supported and publicised, and are in a better position software wise to be utilised. Hence why more projects support it.
No, I think what happened was that Nvidia gave the BOINC devs some money and a couple cards to implement CUDA first. Nvidia also wanted it to coincide with a press release from them, which is why BOINC 6.4.x was released in such a sorry state, but with CUDA crunching.
Another reason why dearest David should spend more time on QA and development and less time on Social Networking and Credit Fixing...
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No, I think what happened was that Nvidia gave the BOINC devs some money and a couple cards to implement CUDA first.
Cards yes, money no. And the cards only to make sure the code they implemented into BOINC actually worked.
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nVidia, with CUDA, is well supported and publicised, and are in a better position software wise to be utilised. Hence why more projects support it.
No, I think what happened was that Nvidia gave the BOINC devs some money and a couple cards to implement CUDA first. Nvidia also wanted it to coincide with a press release from them, which is why BOINC 6.4.x was released in such a sorry state, but with CUDA crunching.
nVidia give out CUDA Fellowship Awards to academics who are promoting the use of CUDA within universities. As such, I'm in the process of acquiring a (free) GTX260 to help learn.
ATi do not do such 'awards', as far as I know.
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But the 4890 is compatible for sure. The relative crunching speed should be the same as I speculated a month ago.
Has the HD4890 been tested as working? Has anyone got it working yet? Does it perform better than the HD4870 for MW crunching?
Has anyone found any MW WUs to test it on?
I did get the 4890 to work & run 2 WU's with Credit Granted with the newly released 9.4 Drivers from ATI/AMD, I posted about it in the zslip.com Thread.
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But the 4890 is compatible for sure. The relative crunching speed should be the same as I speculated a month ago.
Has the HD4890 been tested as working? Has anyone got it working yet? Does it perform better than the HD4870 for MW crunching?
Has anyone found any MW WUs to test it on?
I did get the 4890 to work & run 2 WU's with Credit Granted with the newly released 9.4 Drivers from ATI/AMD, I posted about it in the zslip.com Thread.
Thanks for letting us know PoorBoy. Not only the first 2 WUs cruched on MW with a HD4890, but the most expensive at $125 each ?
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Thanks for letting us know PoorBoy. Not only the first 2 WUs cruched on MW with a HD4890, but the most expensive at $125 each ?
LOL ... Got that right ... :)
It's running the WU's or at least I thought it was anyway but it's not Stable @ all so far. I did get a few more WU's on the Box but every 3 or 4 WU's it goes into VPU Recovery Mode and the WU's Hang & give a Computation Error. The Stock Factory settings are 850 GPU & 975 Memory, I backed it off to 825 GPU & 950 Memory & the same thing happened after 3-4 WU's.
So I backed it off to 800 GPU & 925 Memory & when I restarted BOINC again all the rest of the WU's just gave a Computation Error. Heats not an issue as far as I can see as the Cards only getting up to about 52c when running the WU's & 35c @ Idle.
Trying to get more work on that Box now to see if the WU's error again or what. Did get more & apparently they all erred out so I set it to NNW until I can check a few thing and try a few things ... I Re-booted the Box & shut the CPU WU's off & ran only the MWay WU's at the 800GPU 925 Memory Speeds, it seemed to run okay that way until I tried to run the Default speeds again, then it locked up again and the WU's hung again.
So I reset it back to 800/925, it ran about a dozen WU's okay & then locked up again...Sigh...Technology Advances once again ... :)
I shut it down for now as it won't even run the WU's @ the Stock 4780 Speeds of 750/900 for more than a few WU's without Locking up. I don't have time to mess with it anymore right now but will later this afternoon. I'm going to put it in another Box with a Higher Wattage PSU, the one that's in this Box should be okay because it was running the 4780 just fine. But for some reason it won't run the 4890 even with the CPU WU's shut off.
It has to be the Card & or Drivers I would think, if it won't work in another Box this afternoon I'm calling TigerDirect & try to get a Shipping Label to return them for Free.
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So I backed it off to 800 GPU & 925 Memory & when I restarted BOINC again all the rest of the WU's just gave a Computation Error. Heats not an issue as far as I can see as the Cards only getting up to about 52c when running the WU's & 35c @ Idle.
If heat was the issue it would more likely that the card simply stopped running, and even reset yor PC. Those computation errors are a symptom of a wrong driver - a software incompatibility between the card drivers and the opp app.
As for reducing down from the stock 850 GPU - I would have thought that there should be no need for that, but scope to increase up from 850 to clock it.
I'd be interested in getting a HD4890 myself to play with, but not a good idea just yet based on your experience and the lack of WUs to play with.
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The Box may look like it's running okay right now but that's because I threw the 4870 back in it so it's ran 40-50 WU's okay with that in there, in a few hours I'll try the 4890 in another box but have other things to do right now.
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You have a life outside of MW? :p
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Doesn't expecting the unexpected make the unexpected the expected?
If it makes sense, DON'T do it.
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You have a life outside of MW? :p
No, he does not.
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+3
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Well I was going to keep Reporting on the 4890 & maybe save somebody a few headaches but since everybody wants to get cute about it you can all Kiss the Sunny Side of my Rear End & go & buy one for yourself if you want to see how they run. So I'll have no more to say about the Card from now on.
That Invitation to Kiss the Sunny Side of my Rear End goes out Doubly to Misfit of course, I wouldn't want him to feel left out ... :)
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That Invitation to Kiss the Sunny Side of my Rear End goes out Doubly to Misfit of course, I wouldn't want him to feel left out ... :)
Cry me a river of crocodile tears.
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No, he does not.
Misfit, do you ever have anything constructive to say?
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No, he does not.
Misfit, do you ever have anything constructive to say?
Yes. ::sniff:: You stink.
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No, he does not.
Misfit, do you ever have anything constructive to say?
Yes. ::sniff:: You stink.
Obviously not...never has and never will!
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No, he does not.
Misfit, do you ever have anything constructive to say?
Yes. ::sniff:: You stink.
Obviously not...never has and never will!
Make 7 Up Yours
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"Now, Now, kiddies play nice"
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He's taking himself serious again.
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Every one Take Deep Breath. :)
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Every one Take Deep Breath. :)
How can we...the stench is too much!
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For Faaark sake chill mate
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For Faaark sake chill mate
How people act different on the internet than what they would in person...and some nice distracting other videos
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For Faaark sake chill mate
How people act different on the internet than what they would in person...and some nice distracting other videos
I took screenshots of that video and fwd them to the interweb's mental health police. Then I hammered my S.O.S. transponder like a Pirate Bay tracker.
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soon (Q4 2009) Nvidia use OpenCl with CUDA 3.0
OpenCl is use in RADEON, no?
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soon (Q4 2009) Nvidia use OpenCl with CUDA 3.0
OpenCl is use in RADEON, no?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenCL should tell you everything :)
OpenCL is going to be implemented in ATi Stream and nVidia CUDA soon (yeah, like Q4 09 soon). Both ATi and nVidia have released demonstrations, but it'll be a little while before it gets full release.
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ok, tested it with my HD4890 and have same problem as poorboy.
looks to be a driver problem.
too bad nothing but Cat 9.4 recognizes the card :(
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ok, tested it with my HD4890 and have same problem as poorboy.
looks to be a driver problem.
too bad nothing but Cat 9.4 recognizes the card :(
Cat 9.3 and 9.4 appear to run under Vista though.
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ok, tested it with my HD4890 and have same problem as poorboy.
looks to be a driver problem.
too bad nothing but Cat 9.4 recognizes the card :(
Cat 9.3 and 9.4 appear to run under Vista though.
but was that with an HD4890? that is what the problem is.
I changed the following in the app_info file and running the beta 8.61 driver:
<avg_ncpus>0.8</avg_ncpus>
<max_ncpus>1</max_ncpus>
<cmdline>n1 f10</cmdline>
and now it completes all wu's but did have 1 vpu recovery :(
nevermind, second batch all errored out.
guess time to throw a gtx 260 in and go run gpugrid :(
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guess time to throw a gtx 260 in and go run gpugrid :(
Get a GTX 295 and run two tasks in the same slot size.
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guess time to throw a gtx 260 in and go run gpugrid :(
Get a GTX 295 and run two tasks in the same slot size.
I do have one. but it is being RMA'd right now :(
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The GTX285 gives you the most bang for the buck.
Allthough I have a Q9550 and GTX285 I find it becomes choppy when both cpu and gpu are crunching at the same time while I use the computer. I did set BOINC to stop gpu while computer is in use but all the family uses it constantly.
So for now I just use the cpu side of it to do AP and will undertake the gpu when MW gpu will be set and running.
In my region (Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada) there was a $300 difference between the GTX285 and the GTX295 so I opted for the GTX285 which is plenty for my gaming and any other everyday use.
Gpu is only a great addition to this system but I don't use it quite much as of yet.
Martin Chartrand
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