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Profile[SG-FC] JuHu

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Message 2744 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 17:06:24 UTC
Last modified: 24 Mar 2008, 17:07:28 UTC

Its time to say good bye.

MilkyWay: For 994 sec. work 2.17 points.
PrimeGrid: For 958 sec. work 4.88 points.

Intel Celeron 1,7GHz, 512 MB RAM.


I hope that a lot of crunchers change the project.

This is not the state of the art of changing the credit system. Where are the lot of people with the meaning MW Credits 300% to high?
This is a joke, a very big joke!


Bye
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Profile[B^S] thierry@home
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Message 2746 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 17:11:46 UTC - in response to Message 2744.  

Its time to say good bye.

MilkyWay: For 994 sec. work 2.17 points.
PrimeGrid: For 958 sec. work 4.88 points.

Intel Celeron 1,7GHz, 512 MB RAM.


I hope that a lot of crunchers change the project.

This is not the state of the art of changing the credit system. Where are the lot of people with the meaning MW Credits 300% to high?
This is a joke, a very big joke!


Bye


So, you mean you were not here because the subject is motivating? What a disapointment!
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Profile[SG-FC] JuHu

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Message 2748 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 17:23:47 UTC

Yeah. I'm very frustrated.
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ProfileKevint
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Message 2749 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 17:29:04 UTC - in response to Message 2719.  
Last modified: 24 Mar 2008, 17:32:08 UTC

On second thought -

EDIT _ post deleted. Self moderated.


Got to love halo heads!
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ProfileChertseyAl
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Message 2752 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 18:04:17 UTC - in response to Message 2714.  

RS = they are reducing credit today due to their optimized app that was just released. Check your facts first.


Erm, can you give me a link to this? The only reference I can find at RS says:

"We've been discussing that issue, and haven't come to a final conclusion yet, partially because the linux versions haven't been released".

Which is what I thought Travis was going to do. Get the apps right accross all platforms, get the WU length/content sorted, and make a balanced judgement.

Didn't quite happen like that though ;)

Al.
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Message 2755 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 18:12:32 UTC - in response to Message 2752.  
Last modified: 24 Mar 2008, 18:20:45 UTC

RS = they are reducing credit today due to their optimized app that was just released. Check your facts first.


Erm, can you give me a link to this? The only reference I can find at RS says:

"We've been discussing that issue, and haven't come to a final conclusion yet, partially because the linux versions haven't been released".

Which is what I thought Travis was going to do. Get the apps right accross all platforms, get the WU length/content sorted, and make a balanced judgement.

Didn't quite happen like that though ;)

Al.



RS is still at 27 per wu....edit: Thats on P4 xpsp2 266G-514R 1hr35min per wu
A clear conscience is usually the sign of a bad memory



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ProfileSargeD@SETI.USA

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Message 2756 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 18:15:25 UTC - in response to Message 2732.  

I think 4.5 would be a fair number and still be competitive against other projects. Anything less than that would probably still reduce your "volunteer" base more than you would like to see. Project parity is a pipe dream of David Anderson anyway and a way for him to control all BOINC projects, never mind that a large part of the data he was using was flawed and proven to be so. I really believe that he is using it to try to get back the large part of SETIs volunteer base that have moved on because of the problems there. I really do not want to move on to regular DC projects, but if things keep going the way they are with a credit reduction every time one of us improves the application, that is most likely where I will end up. At least then I would not have to put up with David Anderson's anecdotal behavior. Or maybe we should just make the improvements and use them for ourselves instead of releasing them to the public in general.


Ok, it's not only for credits. If you look your teams's stats, your four preferred projects are Seti, ABC, QMC and Milkyway. By chance they are those who give the more credits. Lucky.
Don't answer. Thanks

You need to look again. We hold number 1 in several projects that you failed to mention. As a matter of fact, we tend to spread ourselves around quite a bit, especially since Formula BOINC started. And how can you say that SETI gives more credits? That is a laugh for sure.
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Message 2757 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 18:26:08 UTC - in response to Message 2756.  

I think 4.5 would be a fair number and still be competitive against other projects. Anything less than that would probably still reduce your "volunteer" base more than you would like to see. Project parity is a pipe dream of David Anderson anyway and a way for him to control all BOINC projects, never mind that a large part of the data he was using was flawed and proven to be so. I really believe that he is using it to try to get back the large part of SETIs volunteer base that have moved on because of the problems there. I really do not want to move on to regular DC projects, but if things keep going the way they are with a credit reduction every time one of us improves the application, that is most likely where I will end up. At least then I would not have to put up with David Anderson's anecdotal behavior. Or maybe we should just make the improvements and use them for ourselves instead of releasing them to the public in general.


Ok, it's not only for credits. If you look your teams's stats, your four preferred projects are Seti, ABC, QMC and Milkyway. By chance they are those who give the more credits. Lucky.
Don't answer. Thanks

You need to look again. We hold number 1 in several projects that you failed to mention. As a matter of fact, we tend to spread ourselves around quite a bit, especially since Formula BOINC started. And how can you say that SETI gives more credits? That is a laugh for sure.


Sarge, he obviously doesn't know that the team regularly asks team members to crunch a project on a rotating basis to support it or improve the teams position regardless of whether it pays well or not.

Often the team pulls crunching power to lower paying projects.

But, then he wouldn't know that since he's not a member of the team.

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Profile[B^S] thierry@home
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Message 2758 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 18:59:32 UTC - in response to Message 2757.  
Last modified: 24 Mar 2008, 18:59:57 UTC

I think 4.5 would be a fair number and still be competitive against other projects. Anything less than that would probably still reduce your "volunteer" base more than you would like to see. Project parity is a pipe dream of David Anderson anyway and a way for him to control all BOINC projects, never mind that a large part of the data he was using was flawed and proven to be so. I really believe that he is using it to try to get back the large part of SETIs volunteer base that have moved on because of the problems there. I really do not want to move on to regular DC projects, but if things keep going the way they are with a credit reduction every time one of us improves the application, that is most likely where I will end up. At least then I would not have to put up with David Anderson's anecdotal behavior. Or maybe we should just make the improvements and use them for ourselves instead of releasing them to the public in general.


Ok, it's not only for credits. If you look your teams's stats, your four preferred projects are Seti, ABC, QMC and Milkyway. By chance they are those who give the more credits. Lucky.
Don't answer. Thanks

You need to look again. We hold number 1 in several projects that you failed to mention. As a matter of fact, we tend to spread ourselves around quite a bit, especially since Formula BOINC started. And how can you say that SETI gives more credits? That is a laugh for sure.


Sarge, he obviously doesn't know that the team regularly asks team members to crunch a project on a rotating basis to support it or improve the teams position regardless of whether it pays well or not.

Often the team pulls crunching power to lower paying projects.

But, then he wouldn't know that since he's not a member of the team.


That's right. But I don't want to discuss to death ;-)
I only find curious (stupid?) that for the same amount of work you get x from one project, y from another and z from another.
It's as curious as you have three guys doing the same job in the same company. The first like white shirts and he gets $50,000 pert year, the second $60,000 because of its blue shirts and the third $70,000 because of its green shirts.
Not very constructive. And I would prefer see people interested in a project because of the subject instead of intereted by the local higher credits.
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Message 2759 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 19:07:23 UTC - in response to Message 2758.  
Last modified: 24 Mar 2008, 19:10:07 UTC

And I would prefer see people interested in a project because of the subject instead of intereted by the local higher credits.


Each to their own, I don't impose my preference on others. Quite frankly, why they crunch a project is up to them.
The project is a business and a cruncher is a customer and what a customer chooses to purchase is their decision. Solid colored shirts over striped over.....
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Message 2760 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 19:08:11 UTC

While everyone here has a right to his/her opinion, I'm still waiting to hear from the admin. Lets face it it's their project and their not stupid, they know this credit thing will determine alot about the user/cruncher base of this project.
Then again they may feel this is not open for discussion.
A clear conscience is usually the sign of a bad memory



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ProfilePhiladelphia
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Message 2761 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 19:11:53 UTC - in response to Message 2760.  
Last modified: 24 Mar 2008, 19:12:36 UTC

While everyone here has a right to his/her opinion, I'm still waiting to hear from the admin. Lets face it it's their project and their not stupid, they know this credit thing will determine alot about the user/cruncher base of this project.
Then again they may feel this is not open for discussion.


As a business they can choose what to charge, in this case pay, for their product. We as a customer choose which product (project) we want to purchase.
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ProfileSargeD@SETI.USA

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Message 2762 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 19:26:06 UTC - in response to Message 2758.  


That's right. But I don't want to discuss to death ;-)
I only find curious (stupid?) that for the same amount of work you get x from one project, y from another and z from another.
It's as curious as you have three guys doing the same job in the same company. The first like white shirts and he gets $50,000 pert year, the second $60,000 because of its blue shirts and the third $70,000 because of its green shirts.
Not very constructive. And I would prefer see people interested in a project because of the subject instead of intereted by the local higher credits.

Be careful throwing around the word stupid! I and my team mates could get very offended by that reference.
What does it matter why someone crunches a project. You do it for the science (or so you say) and I do it for the credits. We both accomplish the same thing and the science gets done. If it were not for the credits, just how much science do you think would get done? There are many more who crunch for the credits than those who do it only for the science and they are usually the ones who have the large farms. If this were not true then there would be no need for credits. I would be willing to bet that if all projects quit giving credits they would very quickly die from lack of participation. SO credits are much more important than you think.
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Message 2763 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 19:30:01 UTC - in response to Message 2755.  

RS is still at 27 per wu....edit: Thats on P4 xpsp2 266G-514R 1hr35min per wu


Ouch! So it is! I'm picking up crazy credit on 2 of my hosts ATM! ;)

Quick! Someone call DA! EMERGENCY!!!!!

;)

Al.
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Message 2765 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 19:40:36 UTC - in response to Message 2763.  

RS is still at 27 per wu....edit: Thats on P4 xpsp2 266G-514R 1hr35min per wu


Ouch! So it is! I'm picking up crazy credit on 2 of my hosts ATM! ;)

Quick! Someone call DA! EMERGENCY!!!!!

;)

Al.


Chuckle Chuckle Smirk!! ;o)
A clear conscience is usually the sign of a bad memory



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Message 2766 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 19:55:01 UTC - in response to Message 2762.  


That's right. But I don't want to discuss to death ;-)
I only find curious (stupid?) that for the same amount of work you get x from one project, y from another and z from another.
It's as curious as you have three guys doing the same job in the same company. The first like white shirts and he gets $50,000 pert year, the second $60,000 because of its blue shirts and the third $70,000 because of its green shirts.
Not very constructive. And I would prefer see people interested in a project because of the subject instead of intereted by the local higher credits.

Be careful throwing around the word stupid! I and my team mates could get very offended by that reference.
What does it matter why someone crunches a project. You do it for the science (or so you say) and I do it for the credits. We both accomplish the same thing and the science gets done. If it were not for the credits, just how much science do you think would get done? There are many more who crunch for the credits than those who do it only for the science and they are usually the ones who have the large farms. If this were not true then there would be no need for credits. I would be willing to bet that if all projects quit giving credits they would very quickly die from lack of participation. SO credits are much more important than you think.



SargeD@SETI.USA hit the proverbial "nail on the head" The farmers who do it for the credit far out weighs those who do it strictly for the science. Why else keep score. How many people would go to their favorite sporting event if no score was kept. There is nothing better than a little competition. I will run those projects that I can get the most credit out of. And I tell you, I've tried most of them.
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Message 2767 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 20:00:26 UTC

Back from the easter holidays and I just see drastically dropped credits.

With the optimized apps, those relatively high credits were honestly earned. When the same work as before ist done in half the time, double credit/timeunit is the only acceptable crediting.

I detached at once never to return. I feel offended.

Or, as we say here, "verarschen kann ich mich allein".

Bye, Groundhog

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Message 2768 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 20:07:05 UTC - in response to Message 2767.  

Back from the easter holidays and I just see drastically dropped credits.

With the optimized apps, those relatively high credits were honestly earned. When the same work as before ist done in half the time, double credit/timeunit is the only acceptable crediting.

I detached at once never to return. I feel offended.

Or, as we say here, "verarschen kann ich mich allein".

Bye, Groundhog




Take note admin: This is just the beginning of the decent!
A clear conscience is usually the sign of a bad memory



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Message 2770 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 20:14:57 UTC - in response to Message 2762.  

... There are many more who crunch for the credits than those who do it only for the science and they are usually the ones who have the large farms....

I think this is very debatable and incorrect.

The overwhelming majority do not care for credits. The overwhelming majority, 300,000+ users, never read any of the fora, never post. That they may monitor credits with their BOINC Manager is then something done as an intellectual exercise or as game/race amongst themselves not as is discussed-without-end by the same credit-hungry that tend to post the same whines in all the fora of all the projects.

The largest, so-termed server-farms, mostly seem to be Einstein project-based and most certainly do not do calculations for credit as they only do Einstein calculations. As for others... they may do many calculations, they may have a significant percentage of the work calculated, but they are in the extreme minority when viewed as a percentage of users.

If they leave... so what? There will still be 300,000+ users doing calculations with more than 300,000 computers connected. Perhaps some projects will see a slow-down in calculations but the work will still be completed.


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Message 2772 - Posted: 24 Mar 2008, 20:27:49 UTC - in response to Message 2766.  


The farmers who do it for the credit far out weighs those who do it strictly for the science.


And, as a result, the farmers actually do More Science!

Perfect.

Al.
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