Welcome to MilkyWay@home

Do MilkyWay need donations? why offline so big time?

Message boards : Number crunching : Do MilkyWay need donations? why offline so big time?
Message board moderation

To post messages, you must log in.

1 · 2 · 3 · Next

AuthorMessage
enterprise
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 24 Sep 09
Posts: 16
Credit: 14,815,215
RAC: 0
Message 33702 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 21:39:15 UTC

Dudes,
Something is happening.. about MW, MW is offline, all the time, There is always a problem..Why is that? Lack of support? (donation)
Why we need MW ? cause 90% of us has an Ati card.. dont we? we are limited to Collatz and MW. Since MW gives more credits(as i know) we should support them.. What do u think ? am i wrong?
Please reply, thank you..
ID: 33702 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Crunch3r
Volunteer developer
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 17 Feb 08
Posts: 363
Credit: 258,227,990
RAC: 0
Message 33706 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 21:57:43 UTC - in response to Message 33702.  

Dudes,
Something is happening.. about MW, MW is offline, all the time, There is always a problem..Why is that?

flue, snowboarding, campus constructions, failing hdd, failing controller... failing[insert word here]


Lack of support? (donation)


No. I think that RPI can cover the cost quite nicely. The NSF is spending more than one 'Grant' on this project.


Why we need MW ?


Yeah, why do we need it ?


cause 90% of us has an Ati card.. dont we? we are limited to Collatz and MW. Since MW gives more credits(as i know) we should support them..


Just wait till the new credit system hits the floor... your ATI GPU will be 'normalized' to either seti gpu credits or will get the average of the CUDA credits here.


What do u think ?


Man.. lots of weird stuff going on in my brain... you really want to know ?


am i wrong?


How do i know ? maybe ?


Please reply, thank you..


I did, you're welcome.


Join Support science! Joinc Team BOINC United now!
ID: 33706 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
enterprise
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 24 Sep 09
Posts: 16
Credit: 14,815,215
RAC: 0
Message 33709 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 22:15:13 UTC
Last modified: 25 Nov 2009, 22:18:26 UTC

Thank you for your fast reply Crunch3r, we have a situation here, people are buying new graphic cards to make more credits.. is this science or what is it?

"Just wait till the new credit system hits the floor... your ATI GPU will be 'normalized' to either seti gpu credits or will get the average of the CUDA credits here.
"
what do you mean by that? should i be sorry cause i got an Ati card?
:)
ID: 33709 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
STE\/E

Send message
Joined: 29 Aug 07
Posts: 486
Credit: 576,548,171
RAC: 15
Message 33710 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 22:15:50 UTC

I donated $50 awhile back, I would have thought that would have fixed everything, well at least bought enough Donuts to last the Dev Dept for awhile anyway ... :)
ID: 33710 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
enterprise
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 24 Sep 09
Posts: 16
Credit: 14,815,215
RAC: 0
Message 33712 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 22:32:01 UTC - in response to Message 33710.  

That's the spirit..:)
we need credits, they need solutions and solutions and money, there is a problem here. will you donate for more credits ?
ID: 33712 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Crunch3r
Volunteer developer
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 17 Feb 08
Posts: 363
Credit: 258,227,990
RAC: 0
Message 33713 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 22:43:29 UTC - in response to Message 33709.  

Thank you for your fast reply Crunch3r, we have a situation here, people are buying new graphic cards to make more credits.. is this science or what is it?


I'm not quite sure about that myself... Good question. :p


"Just wait till the new credit system hits the floor... your ATI GPU will be 'normalized' to either seti gpu credits or will get the average of the CUDA credits here.
"
what do you mean by that? should i be sorry cause i got an Ati card?
:)


Just wait and see. Wouldn't be fun if i tell you all the details. ;)





Join Support science! Joinc Team BOINC United now!
ID: 33713 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Crunch3r
Volunteer developer
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 17 Feb 08
Posts: 363
Credit: 258,227,990
RAC: 0
Message 33714 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 22:44:56 UTC - in response to Message 33712.  

That's the spirit..:)
we need credits, they need solutions and solutions and money, there is a problem here. will you donate for more credits ?



I'm sure that PoorBoy is already excited about the idea of donating more Donuts..

Right PB ? :p




Join Support science! Joinc Team BOINC United now!
ID: 33714 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
boosted

Send message
Joined: 4 Feb 08
Posts: 116
Credit: 17,263,566
RAC: 0
Message 33718 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 23:04:07 UTC
Last modified: 25 Nov 2009, 23:10:22 UTC

Why must people always be asking why this project is always down. It is like asking why the sun shines... it just does, and it just is.
I do not feel like going into my personal feeling about this project and how it is run...
But the new hard drives sure seemed to fix the issues...<-sarcasm

On the new credit tables, who knows... maybe they will say that all work units are worth 1 point, maybe they will be worth a free imaginary pizza or maybe they will each be worth 4000 credits.
I just think that it is sad that it seems that every time that they 'adjust' the credits, they lower them. They had a pay table that was accurate per second of crunch time. For some reason (that I will not go into) they have changed it now several times.
At least every time that they do this, a new app comes out to 'soften' the credit blow by further streamlining the crunch process. I applaud the effort in streamlining this calculation process, and it deserves great respect. While faster calc times are good, I think most of the reason behind it is to soften the credit blows... only the creator can answer this. I only have my stated suspicions.

I just wonder why the credit tables are in constant shrinking flux... I mean hell is Wayne Szalinski running this project or something? I think he is cause the credits are ever shrinking...

As far as your point in asking about donations... from what I have read people have donated funds. However nothing was ever said about how much was raised, what they were used for... like so many other news updates, not much unless the shitith hitith the fanith in the forum areas. Then something is said eventually.



I'm a little reluctant to do big software upgrades while the hardware is having issues, because the last thing we need is a big bad database corruption that would hose all your credits and accounts.

But it is such a frequent thing around here... why break the cycle now?
ID: 33718 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Travis
Volunteer moderator
Project administrator
Project developer
Project tester
Project scientist

Send message
Joined: 30 Aug 07
Posts: 2046
Credit: 26,480
RAC: 0
Message 33719 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 23:07:05 UTC - in response to Message 33702.  

Dudes,
Something is happening.. about MW, MW is offline, all the time, There is always a problem..Why is that? Lack of support? (donation)
Why we need MW ? cause 90% of us has an Ati card.. dont we? we are limited to Collatz and MW. Since MW gives more credits(as i know) we should support them.. What do u think ? am i wrong?
Please reply, thank you..



We've had some rather unexpected hardware problems due to construction on campus. The vibrations wrecked our hard drives and now its looking like some other things as well.

There's not too much we can do about it as ordering the hardware and installing it takes time. It being a vacation week right now doesn't help either as our labstaff aren't around. I'm hoping when we replace the controller the hardware will be back and running stable, which should help out quite a bit.

I'm a little reluctant to do big software upgrades while the hardware is having issues, because the last thing we need is a big bad database corruption that would hose all your credits and accounts.

Either way, we'll know more about the hardware issue in the next couple days (hopefully we don't have another crash). Next week when labstaff is back I'll be in their office bugging them to get the server software upgraded.

Until then I wouldn't worry too much and enjoy some turkey, if you're in the states :P
ID: 33719 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Travis
Volunteer moderator
Project administrator
Project developer
Project tester
Project scientist

Send message
Joined: 30 Aug 07
Posts: 2046
Credit: 26,480
RAC: 0
Message 33723 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 23:09:58 UTC - in response to Message 33706.  


Just wait till the new credit system hits the floor... your ATI GPU will be 'normalized' to either seti gpu credits or will get the average of the CUDA credits here.


I'm pretty sure that's not how the scheme works. From what I've heard credits will be awarded by a mixture of the time spent and the potential peak FLOPS of the devices it's running on.

I'm thinking when we use the new credit scheme if anything credits will be normalized around the ATI GPUs here at this project -- because they're offering the peak FLOPS/second.

Either way, if the credits from the new system are unsatisfactory, we'll either get the new credit scheme changed or go back to what we're currently doing right now.
ID: 33723 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
STE\/E

Send message
Joined: 29 Aug 07
Posts: 486
Credit: 576,548,171
RAC: 15
Message 33725 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 23:17:54 UTC - in response to Message 33714.  

That's the spirit..:)
we need credits, they need solutions and solutions and money, there is a problem here. will you donate for more credits ?



I'm sure that PoorBoy is already excited about the idea of donating more Donuts..

Right PB ? :p




Ummmmmmmm Yeah Right ... NOT ... That's all I'd need to do is Donate More & then get B'ed from the Project ... :P
ID: 33725 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
STE\/E

Send message
Joined: 29 Aug 07
Posts: 486
Credit: 576,548,171
RAC: 15
Message 33726 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 23:19:42 UTC - in response to Message 33718.  
Last modified: 25 Nov 2009, 23:47:27 UTC

I'm a little reluctant to do big software upgrades while the hardware is having issues, because the last thing we need is a big bad database corruption that would hose all your credits and accounts.

But it is such a frequent thing around here... why break the cycle now?


LOL ... Whats 100 Million lost here or there anymore ... ;)
ID: 33726 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Crunch3r
Volunteer developer
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 17 Feb 08
Posts: 363
Credit: 258,227,990
RAC: 0
Message 33728 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 23:35:29 UTC


Just wait till the new credit system hits the floor... your ATI GPU will be 'normalized' to either seti gpu credits or will get the average of the CUDA credits here.


I'm pretty sure that's not how the scheme works. From what I've heard credits will be awarded by a mixture of the time spent and the potential peak FLOPS of the devices it's running on.


Then why is there a need for that central server which all projects have to go to get the calculated credit ? This new scheme doesn't even take into account that some 64 bit apps are twice as fast as their 32 counterparts or if we're doing DP, integers or SP...those will get leveled as well.

Same will apply for any "optimized" code.. It will make no difference if you optimize an app for SSE2 or leave it as it is.
No benefit from that ( at least not for the participants)

And why is SETI being used as a mesure stick for GPU apps (CUDA) ? We all know that SETIs Cuda app is one of the worst perfoming cuda apps out there...
(uses at best 20% of the peak flops, most times it is even worse)


I'm thinking when we use the new credit scheme if anything credits will be normalized around the ATI GPUs here at this project -- because they're offering the peak FLOPS/second.


The lastest boinc client uses peak flops for cuda as well, since it doesn't make any sence to stick to what it was before (20% peak calibrated on... guess what ... SETI)


Either way, if the credits from the new system are unsatisfactory, we'll either get the new credit scheme changed or go back to what we're currently doing right now.


So don't even go there at all.
You know, if it aint broke... dont fix it!




Join Support science! Joinc Team BOINC United now!
ID: 33728 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
enterprise
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 24 Sep 09
Posts: 16
Credit: 14,815,215
RAC: 0
Message 33729 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 23:52:37 UTC - in response to Message 33728.  
Last modified: 25 Nov 2009, 23:54:05 UTC

And why is SETI being used as a mesure stick for GPU apps (CUDA) ? We all know that SETIs Cuda app is one of the worst perfoming cuda apps out there...
(uses at best 20% of the peak flops, most times it is even worse)


etc.. etc...
etc

Seti with NVýdia sucks? So, what do we have in our hands? what do we do about it?
we are ATI, no need to say..
ID: 33729 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
enterprise
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 24 Sep 09
Posts: 16
Credit: 14,815,215
RAC: 0
Message 33730 - Posted: 25 Nov 2009, 23:57:08 UTC - in response to Message 33729.  

why dont you just A.T.I me?:)
ID: 33730 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
STE\/E

Send message
Joined: 29 Aug 07
Posts: 486
Credit: 576,548,171
RAC: 15
Message 33731 - Posted: 26 Nov 2009, 0:00:09 UTC - in response to Message 33729.  

And why is SETI being used as a mesure stick for GPU apps (CUDA) ? We all know that SETIs Cuda app is one of the worst perfoming cuda apps out there...
(uses at best 20% of the peak flops, most times it is even worse)


etc.. etc...
etc

Seti with NVýdia sucks? So, what do we have in our hands? what do we do about it?
we are ATI, no need to say..


SETI with ATI Sucks, I tried it and thought this has got to be some sort of Joke ...
ID: 33731 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Donnie
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 19 Jul 08
Posts: 67
Credit: 272,086,462
RAC: 0
Message 33733 - Posted: 26 Nov 2009, 0:28:35 UTC - in response to Message 33728.  
Last modified: 26 Nov 2009, 0:38:40 UTC

Then why is there a need for that central server which all projects have to go to get the calculated credit ? This new scheme doesn't even take into account that some 64 bit apps are twice as fast as their 32 counterparts or if we're doing DP, integers or SP...those will get leveled as well.


Thank you Crunch3r for reading the new credit scheme.

Suppose a project has an app with only a GPU version, so there's no CPU version to act as a sanity check. If we grant credit based only on GPU peak speed, the project will grant much more credit per GPU hour than other projects, violating limited project neutrality - so this wouldn't apply here.

A solution to this: if an app has only GPU versions, then for each version V we let S(V) be the average scaling factor for that GPU type among projects that do have both CPU and GPU versions. This factor is obtained from a central BOINC server. V's jobs are then scaled by S(V) as above.


So the degree of hosing is S(V), according to a central BOINC server controlled by UCB & DA and minions?

Check it out:

Proposed new BOINC credit system:

New Credit System
ID: 33733 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile banditwolf
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 12 Nov 07
Posts: 2425
Credit: 524,164
RAC: 0
Message 33734 - Posted: 26 Nov 2009, 0:33:59 UTC

Lack of support? (donation)


No. I think that RPI can cover the cost quite nicely. The NSF is spending more than one 'Grant' on this project.


That has always been my thinking.

Ummmmmmmm Yeah Right ... NOT ... That's all I'd need to do is Donate More & then get B'ed from the Project ... :P

I could see that happening. Send me the donut money instead. :p

I'm thinking when we use the new credit scheme if anything credits will be normalized around the ATI GPUs here at this project -- because they're offering the peak FLOPS/second.


The lastest boinc client uses peak flops for cuda as well, since it doesn't make any sence to stick to what it was before (20% peak calibrated on... guess what ... SETI)

I guess this is the "It's not broke so I have to fix scenario"
Doesn't expecting the unexpected make the unexpected the expected?
If it makes sense, DON'T do it.
ID: 33734 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Travis
Volunteer moderator
Project administrator
Project developer
Project tester
Project scientist

Send message
Joined: 30 Aug 07
Posts: 2046
Credit: 26,480
RAC: 0
Message 33736 - Posted: 26 Nov 2009, 0:42:51 UTC - in response to Message 33734.  

Lack of support? (donation)


No. I think that RPI can cover the cost quite nicely. The NSF is spending more than one 'Grant' on this project.


That has always been my thinking.


Actually, the grants listed are almost all over. I think right now we're currently operating off the very last bit of one NSF grant coupled with another minor 1 year grant.

I know the professors working on the project have been very busy writing proposals so hopefully we'll have more funding to play around with if/when those come in.

As to RPI giving us money -- you don't know too much about academia :P We receive support from labstaff (which comes through RPI), and we're located on campus, but when it comes to actual dollars to spend on equipment or students, all that has to come from grants.
ID: 33736 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Donnie
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 19 Jul 08
Posts: 67
Credit: 272,086,462
RAC: 0
Message 33741 - Posted: 26 Nov 2009, 2:20:27 UTC - in response to Message 33736.  
Last modified: 26 Nov 2009, 3:01:59 UTC

As to RPI giving us money -- you don't know too much about academia :P We receive support from labstaff (which comes through RPI), and we're located on campus, but when it comes to actual dollars to spend on equipment or students, all that has to come from grants.


So what happend to the donations we gave to the project? Did it buy hardware and jobs or donuts?

This smells like bullshit!!!

This is the letter I received when I donated:

Dear Donator:

Thank you for your generous donation to the MilkyWay@Home Fund of the Dudley Observatory. Below is a summary of your donation:

Date: 8/14/2009
Amount: $50.00
Deductible: $50.00
Fund: MilkyWay@Home/ donation
Payment: Online Payment

As you know, the majority of our costs directly support students who maintain the servers, answer your questions in the forum, create new Milky Way models and improve the computing infrastructure, and create knowledge from our activities. In so doing, they learn how to become the researchers of the future. Thanks to your generosity, we will be able to fund graduate and undergraduate students, travel, publication, materials, and equipment costs related to Milky Way research and education.

Thank you again for your support of MilkyWay@Home.

Clear Skies,
Janie Schwab
Executive Director
Please keep this letter for your income tax records.

[Edit]

I forgot you guys are in N.Y. Guess we could contact New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo, huh?

[/edit]
ID: 33741 · Rating: 0 · rate: Rate + / Rate - Report as offensive     Reply Quote
1 · 2 · 3 · Next

Message boards : Number crunching : Do MilkyWay need donations? why offline so big time?

©2024 Astroinformatics Group