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robertmiles

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Message 50264 - Posted: 20 Jul 2011, 1:35:43 UTC

The FX 3800 is an Nvidia Quadro design.

http://www.funtech.com/NVIDIA-Quadro-FX-3800

Its spec sheet doesn't mention a Fermi GPU chip.

Unclear if a Windows 7 version of a driver for it is available.

To me, it looks like an older design unlikely to be suitable for Milkyway@Home, but you should wait for an opinion from someone more familiar with it before you give up entirely.
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robertmiles

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Message 50265 - Posted: 20 Jul 2011, 2:05:30 UTC
Last modified: 20 Jul 2011, 2:16:32 UTC

Nvidia's spec sheet for the FX 3800:
http://www.nvidia.com/object/product_quadro_fx_3800_us.html
Mentions that it was designed for professionals (and therefore probably originally rather expensive)

A list of legacy products that mentions it:
http://www.nvidia.com/page/quadrofx_family.html

Seems that a Windows 7 driver IS available for it:
http://www.nvidia.com/object/io_1241025430517.html

Some comparison info:
http://www.nvidia.com/content/PDF/product-comparison/product-comparison-master-revised.pdf

Still no information about whether it has the main feature required for Milkyway@Home - hardware double precision support.

When you start BOINC, do the first few lines of the Messages tab of the Advanced view mention finding its GPU and what computing capability it has?

For example, here are the first few lines of that tab for my desktop:

7/16/2011 7:40:56 PM Starting BOINC client version 6.10.58 for windows_x86_64
7/16/2011 7:40:56 PM log flags: file_xfer, sched_ops, task
7/16/2011 7:40:56 PM Libraries: libcurl/7.19.7 OpenSSL/0.9.8l zlib/1.2.3
7/16/2011 7:40:56 PM Data directory: C:\ProgramData\BOINC
7/16/2011 7:40:56 PM Running under account Bobby
7/16/2011 7:40:57 PM Processor: 4 GenuineIntel Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q9650 @ 3.00GHz [Family 6 Model 23 Stepping 10]
7/16/2011 7:40:57 PM Processor: 6.00 MB cache
7/16/2011 7:40:57 PM Processor features: fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat pse36 clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss htt tm pni ssse3 cx16 sse4_1 syscall nx lm vmx smx tm2 pbe
7/16/2011 7:40:57 PM OS: Microsoft Windows Vista: Home Premium x64 Edition, Service Pack 2, (06.00.6002.00)
7/16/2011 7:40:57 PM Memory: 8.00 GB physical, 15.74 GB virtual
7/16/2011 7:40:57 PM Disk: 919.67 GB total, 540.84 GB free
7/16/2011 7:40:57 PM Local time is UTC -5 hours
7/16/2011 7:40:57 PM NVIDIA GPU 0: GeForce GTS 450 (driver version 27533, CUDA version 4000, compute capability 2.1, 962MB, 476 GFLOPS peak)

The last line of this group is the one to look for.
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Profilek6xt

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Message 50308 - Posted: 21 Jul 2011, 4:54:08 UTC - in response to Message 50251.  
Last modified: 21 Jul 2011, 5:00:00 UTC


If you get the max elapsed time exceeded error, try with the app_info.xml.


..And that's exactly the result. All WU still error out.
http://milkyway.cs.rpi.edu/milkyway/result.php?resultid=71860152

By "..try with the app_info.xml" do you mean from this site?
http://www.mpits.net/opt_mw.php

Edit: I installed the optimized app and appinfo.xml from http://www.mpits.net/opt_mw.php, the SSE4.1 version which CPUZ says my Q9650 will do. The GPU is GTX275, driver 275.33. MW downloaded only separation apps. Every one completed in one second with this:
...

Sorry, those apps are for CPU, not for GPU!

Snip

Win XP might need a little treaking of the app_info to keep the system responsible. But let's get your GPUs working first.


I did this. After editing app_info.xml (see BELOW) I seem to be processing MW WU OK, no errors and earning credit.

BELOW: I want to call attention to a possible error in the app_info.xml distributed for 32 but ATI applications. Here is a copy of the file I received on download:
-----------------
<app_info>
<app>
<name>milkyway</name>
</app>
<file_info>
<name>mmilkyway_separation_0.82_windows_intelx86__ati14.exe</name>
<executable/>
</file_info>
<app_version>
<app_name>milkyway</app_name>
<version_num>82</version_num>
<flops>1.0e11</flops>
<avg_ncpus>0.05</avg_ncpus>
<max_ncpus>1</max_ncpus>
<plan_class>ati14ati</plan_class>
<coproc>
<type>ATI</type>
<count>1</count>
</coproc>
<cmdline></cmdline>
<file_ref>
<file_name>milkyway_separation_0.82_windows_intelx86__ati14.exe</file_name>
<main_program/>
</file_ref>
</app_version>
</app_info>
-----------------------------
I found MW would not work with this filename in the xml (see above):

<name>mmilkyway_separation_0.82_windows_intelx86__ati14.exe</name>

***Note the name MMilkyway_separation...etc.

My XP 32 bit ATI 4870 PC would not process until I removed the duplicate M. Once that was done things seem to work.

Is that what Len LE/GE means by:

"Win XP might need a little treaking of the app_info to keep the system responsible. But let's get your GPUs working first."

And could this be the reason 32 bit ATI xml's need "a little tweaking"?? It was for me.

Removing the double M from the xml all is well. On my 4870 WU's are taking about 2.5 minutes.

Regards
Art
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Message 50320 - Posted: 21 Jul 2011, 13:55:31 UTC

So thanks for the help on the FX3800, below is what I am seeing from the start of the event log:


7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Starting BOINC client version 6.12.33 for windows_x86_64
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | log flags: file_xfer, sched_ops, task
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Libraries: libcurl/7.19.7 OpenSSL/0.9.8l zlib/1.2.5
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Data directory: C:\ProgramData\BOINC
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Running under account kroseler
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Processor: 8 GenuineIntel Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU W3550 @ 3.07GHz [Family 6 Model 26 Stepping 5]
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Processor: 256.00 KB cache
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Processor features: fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat pse36 clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss htt tm pni ssse3 cx16 sse4_1 sse4_2 syscall nx lm vmx tm2 dca popcnt pbe
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | OS: Microsoft Windows 7: Enterprise x64 Edition, (06.01.7600.00)
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Memory: 15.99 GB physical, 31.98 GB virtual
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Disk: 232.88 GB total, 197.27 GB free
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Local time is UTC -5 hours
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | No usable GPUs found
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | Milkyway@home | Application uses missing NVIDIA GPU


I am running the nvidia driver rev of 8.17.12.7081. Not sure if that helps.
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Timo

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Message 50326 - Posted: 21 Jul 2011, 15:13:49 UTC

Has anyone had a chance to see if the new AMD Llano APUs have DP Graphics and any experience with getting MW@H to run on them? I know AMD has put a lot into marketing these chips as having integrated direct computer capabilities, but it wont help us here if the double-precision ability is not there, otherwise it looks like a very power-efficient alternative.
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FruehwF

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Message 50327 - Posted: 21 Jul 2011, 16:21:04 UTC - in response to Message 50320.  

So thanks for the help on the FX3800, below is what I am seeing from the start of the event log:


7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Starting BOINC client version 6.12.33 for windows_x86_64
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | log flags: file_xfer, sched_ops, task
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Libraries: libcurl/7.19.7 OpenSSL/0.9.8l zlib/1.2.5
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Data directory: C:\ProgramData\BOINC
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Running under account kroseler
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Processor: 8 GenuineIntel Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU W3550 @ 3.07GHz [Family 6 Model 26 Stepping 5]
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Processor: 256.00 KB cache
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Processor features: fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat pse36 clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss htt tm pni ssse3 cx16 sse4_1 sse4_2 syscall nx lm vmx tm2 dca popcnt pbe
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | OS: Microsoft Windows 7: Enterprise x64 Edition, (06.01.7600.00)
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Memory: 15.99 GB physical, 31.98 GB virtual
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Disk: 232.88 GB total, 197.27 GB free
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | Local time is UTC -5 hours
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | No usable GPUs found
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | Milkyway@home | Application uses missing NVIDIA GPU


I am running the nvidia driver rev of 8.17.12.7081. Not sure if that helps.



Quadro FX 3800 COMPUTE CAPABILITY 1.3
So it should work.

but i can't say much, i have no Nvidias
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ProfileBeyond

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Message 50328 - Posted: 21 Jul 2011, 16:32:06 UTC - in response to Message 50326.  

Has anyone had a chance to see if the new AMD Llano APUs have DP Graphics and any experience with getting MW@H to run on them? I know AMD has put a lot into marketing these chips as having integrated direct computer capabilities, but it wont help us here if the double-precision ability is not there, otherwise it looks like a very power-efficient alternative.

It would also be interesting to know how they work on other projects like Collatz and Moo!
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robertmiles

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Message 50354 - Posted: 25 Jul 2011, 18:54:57 UTC - in response to Message 50320.  
Last modified: 25 Jul 2011, 19:01:39 UTC

So thanks for the help on the FX3800, below is what I am seeing from the start of the event log:
[snip]
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | | No usable GPUs found
7/19/2011 2:54:21 PM | Milkyway@home | Application uses missing NVIDIA GPU


I am running the nvidia driver rev of 8.17.12.7081. Not sure if that helps.


One thing I've read of that sometimes helps with that situation:

Did you install BOINC to run as a service instead of requiring you to be logged in? If you did, it will probably be unable to make it use any GPUs at all until you reinstall it without telling it to run as a service.
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Message 50366 - Posted: 25 Jul 2011, 22:43:58 UTC - in response to Message 50308.  


I found MW would not work with this filename in the xml (see above):

<name>mmilkyway_separation_0.82_windows_intelx86__ati14.exe</name>

***Note the name MMilkyway_separation...etc.

My XP 32 bit ATI 4870 PC would not process until I removed the duplicate M. Once that was done things seem to work.

Is that what Len LE/GE means by:

"Win XP might need a little treaking of the app_info to keep the system responsible. But let's get your GPUs working first."

And could this be the reason 32 bit ATI xml's need "a little tweaking"?? It was for me.

Removing the double M from the xml all is well. On my 4870 WU's are taking about 2.5 minutes.

Regards
Art


Problem app_info is fixed now, I was copying and pasting fast and most likely did not select all of the previous contents before pasting.
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Message 50558 - Posted: 6 Aug 2011, 15:00:27 UTC - in response to Message 50366.  

I've run MW in the past using an app_info.xml to process multiple WUs simultaneously with no problem. During the recent "break" I saw that the app numbers had changed so I modified the app_info.xml file accordingly (from .52 to .82, for example). Now, although I don't get any error messages, I also can't process multiple WUs simultaneously anymore. It assigns the whole GPU to the WU. All my GPUs are Nvidia.


I'm having this problem even with my new NVIDIA GTX 550TI card with 2 GB of video ram. For this card, I even went and installed the latest Nvidia drivers (280.13) but no joy. Ubuntu 11.04 is currently with something like 270.19.

Am I missing something or are the WUs so demanding for video ram on the GPUs that multiple simultaneous WUs are no longer possible?

Thanks for any help that you can provide.

Regards,
Steve
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Message 50560 - Posted: 6 Aug 2011, 17:36:28 UTC - in response to Message 50558.  

I've run MW in the past using an app_info.xml to process multiple WUs simultaneously with no problem. During the recent "break" I saw that the app numbers had changed so I modified the app_info.xml file accordingly (from .52 to .82, for example). Now, although I don't get any error messages, I also can't process multiple WUs simultaneously anymore. It assigns the whole GPU to the WU. All my GPUs are Nvidia.


I'm having this problem even with my new NVIDIA GTX 550TI card with 2 GB of video ram. For this card, I even went and installed the latest Nvidia drivers (280.13) but no joy. Ubuntu 11.04 is currently with something like 270.19.

Am I missing something or are the WUs so demanding for video ram on the GPUs that multiple simultaneous WUs are no longer possible?

Thanks for any help that you can provide.

Regards,
Steve


Seeing how the CUDA app is also OpenCL, try inserting "-instances_per_device 2" in you app_info <cmdline> instructions.

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europa

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Message 50563 - Posted: 6 Aug 2011, 22:14:21 UTC - in response to Message 50560.  

Thanks for the suggestion. However, it "sounds" like it's for a Windows app_info.xml. I'm on Ubuntu. :)

However, I will see if I can work it in.

Regards,
Steve

P.S. This is interesting. When I re-start Boinc as a service and look at the initial messages, I see a line where it sees the E@H app_info.xml but there is no mention of the one for MW@H. If it doesn't even see the app_info file that would explain why no multiple WU's but then why doesn't it see the file?
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robertmiles

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Message 50566 - Posted: 7 Aug 2011, 3:28:59 UTC - in response to Message 50563.  

Remember, when BOINC is started as a service, it's generally unable to use any GPU at all, regardless of what GPU you have.
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europa

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Message 50572 - Posted: 7 Aug 2011, 11:01:01 UTC - in response to Message 50566.  

Oh, Boinc is seeing the GPUs no problem. The problem is that MW (but not E@H) either does not see the app_info.xml at start up or ignores it and only runs one WU/GPU instead of 2 as it has in the past with the entry set to .5.

Since this is affecting all of my machines and started after the downtime last week, I'm becoming convinced that the problem is not at my end.

Regards,
Steve
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Message 50620 - Posted: 9 Aug 2011, 23:17:51 UTC - in response to Message 50560.  

Seeing how the CUDA app is also OpenCL, try inserting "-instances_per_device 2" in you app_info instructions.
That isn't a flag it uses, so that won't do anything. People running 2 change the number of used GPUs to 0.5 or something like that.
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Message 50622 - Posted: 10 Aug 2011, 1:01:57 UTC - in response to Message 50563.  

Can you show a listing of the files in your MW folder and also post the app_info.xml text.
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Message 50641 - Posted: 11 Aug 2011, 2:05:48 UTC

Hmm. Hey guys.
I'm just wondering about this.
What would be the most efficient way to crunch MW ?
I have GTX560Ti currently which is munching away GPUGrid.
My cpu is mainly running WCG but this month I'm helpin my team OCN boost it's points in malariacontrol.
I'm not interested in the points. Just about the what would be better..
I guess it's my 560Ti ?

Probably the wrong thread but figured pointless to create a new thread so I'll just post this here.
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robertmiles

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Message 50642 - Posted: 11 Aug 2011, 3:30:42 UTC - in response to Message 50641.  
Last modified: 11 Aug 2011, 3:33:19 UTC

Any of the high-end AMD/ATI GPUs that can handle double precision are best. Scroll back to the first post in this thread to see most of them listed.

Any Fermi-based card, such as your 560Ti, or any GTX2xx series card from GTX260 up, come in second.

Using your CPU cores comes in a distant third.
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Message 50645 - Posted: 11 Aug 2011, 7:06:40 UTC

Yeah well I know that already, but thanks for answering! :)
I may have shaped my question wrong.
What I was meaning is the efficiency, meaning how much power used to complete certain amount of project data in what time or something like that.
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Message 50650 - Posted: 11 Aug 2011, 13:52:38 UTC - in response to Message 50622.  

Thanks for the help.

Here is the information that you requested. Everything runs fine, EXCEPT that no matter what I do, the Fermi's only process one WU at a time each.

It's a problem on all 3 machines. They're all running under Ubuntu 11.04, AMD multi-cores with Fermi cards and at least 8GB of either DDDR2 or DDR3 ram.

Just as a test, I re-started Collatz and it's running 3WU's simultaneously per Fermi so I don't think it's HW or Boinc. E@H was also running fine.

I've also gone back and forth with file permissions with the app_info.xml and the executables but that didn't make any difference.

Here's the list of files.

/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/app_info.xml
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/histogram
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/milkyway_nbody_0.62_x86_64-pc-linux-gnu__mt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/milkyway_separation_0.82_x86_64-pc-linux-gnu__cuda_opencl
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/milkyway_separation_0.88_x86_64-pc-linux-gnu
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/orphan_test_2model.lua
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/p-17-3s-fix2.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/parameters-10-3s-fix2.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/parameters-10-3s-fix-new2.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/parameters-13.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/parameters-13-3s-fix-new2.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/parameters-82-2s.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/single_t82_0.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/single_t82_1.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/single_t82_2.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/single_t82_3.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/single_t82_4.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/stars-10-good.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/stars-13.txt
/var/lib/boinc-client/projects/milkyway.cs.rpi.edu_milkyway/stars-17.txt

and here's the app_info.xml.

<file_ref>
<file_name>
milkyway_nbody_0.62_x86_64-pc-linux-gnu__mt
</file_name>
<main_program/>
</file_ref>
</app_version>
</app_info>

<app>
<name>milkyway</name>
<user_friendly_name>Milkyway@home</user_friendly_name>
</app>

<file_info>
<name>milkyway_0.88_x86_64-pc-linux-gnu</name>
<executable/>
</file_info>

<app_version>
<app_name>milkyway</app_name>
<version_num>88</version_num>
<avg_ncpus>0.05</avg_ncpus>
<max_ncpus>0.05</max_ncpus>
<flops>1.0e11</flops>
<file_ref>
<file_name>milkyway_0.88_x86_64-pc-linux-gnu</file_name>
<main_program/>
</file_ref>
</app_version>

<app_info>
<app>
<name>milkyway</name>
<user_friendly_name>Milkyway@home</user_friendly_name>
</app>

<file_info>
<name>milkyway_0.88_x86_64-pc-linux-gnu__sse2</name>
<executable/>
</file_info>

<app_version>
<app_name>milkyway</app_name>
<version_num>88</version_num>
<plan_class>sse2</plan_class>
<avg_ncpus>0.05</avg_ncpus>
<max_ncpus>0.05</max_ncpus>
<flops>1.0e11</flops>

<file_ref>
<file_name>milkyway_0.88_x86_64-pc-linux-gnu__sse2</file_name>
<main_program/>
</file_ref>
</app_version>
<app_info>

Thanks again for the help.

Regards,
Steve
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