PoorBoy you're running 6.5.0, which I haven't tested. The settings I'm using are all for 6.4.7. Have you tried that manager yet?

Just checked my Box's with 6.4.7, 1 Box with 4 Waiting to run & the rest of the MWay Wu's just sitting there doing nothing. Another Box with none even waiting to run & all MWay Wu's just sitting there doing nothing. Reset both Box's & each is running 1 MWay Wu when the Default is 3 and I've got the App set to 4. So 6.4.7 works about as good as 6.50 on my Box's anyway.

Check your project debts. In the main BOINC data directory you should find a client_state.xml file with all the projects current status in it. Betting MW is sitting at some large negative number for debt, which is why it isn't running. The BOINC Manager treats it like a CPU app, and gets progressively more angry about it running more than the normal CPU apps (since it's using GPU time instead). It runs enough work on my system that I have to reset debts hourly to keep it running predictably.

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I've done all that numerous time, you shouldn't have to do it though. I have Milkyway set to run 99.20% of the time on my i7 yet if I didn't constantly coax it into running more MWay Wu's the ATI Cards would sit Idle 1/2 the day or more ...

Right now I've just stopped running anything but the ATI Cards on those Box's, the CPU's can sit Idle if that's what it takes to keep the ATI Cards running.

I didn't invest the Money I did in the ATI Cards with more coming to just see them sit Idle because their waiting to run ...

I assume you've tried a reset of MW? Is it any better with 100% resource share? Try suspending your other project. To me it could be burning through the wus so fast it's running up a hige debt and waiting for your other project to sort it out.

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Doesn't expecting the unexpected make the unexpected the expected?
If it makes sense, DON'T do it.

I assume you've tried a reset of MW? Is it any better with 100% resource share? Try suspending your other project. To me it could be burning through the wus so fast it's running up a hige debt and waiting for your other project to sort it out.

Yes, I've reset the Project many times only to come back a short time later to find 1/2 my Box's waiting to run again. I'm gong to try a few other Projects & see if they run better because they sure arn't getting along with Prime Grid anymore for some reason, they used too but not anymore.

I've done all that numerous time, you shouldn't have to do it though. I have Milkyway set to run 99.20% of the time on my i7 yet if I didn't constantly coax it into running more MWay Wu's the ATI Cards would sit Idle 1/2 the day or more ...

Right now I've just stopped running anything but the ATI Cards on those Box's, the CPU's can sit Idle if that's what it takes to keep the ATI Cards running.

I didn't invest the Money I did in the ATI Cards with more coming to just see them sit Idle because their waiting to run ...

Done all what numerous times? If you're reseting debt you have to do it hourly to keep up with the project. It's not a one time fix, it's something you have to do constantly in order to keep the project going. And no, you shouldn't have to do it, but that's the BOINC managers fault not MWs. The app is GPU but not CUDA, the manager doesn't understand any GPU apps but CUDA, therefore it schedules it like a CPU app. The fact it runs all the time despite the CPU not being used constantly digs itself further into "negative" debt, i.e. telling the manager to schedule the other projects before it.

My system with just a single OEM spec 512MB HD4870 ran itself to -18000 debt in just a few days and wouldn't run MW work at all because it was waiting for the other projects to "catch up."

As for 99% that doesn't matter, because it's going to run 100% of the time and constantly dig itself into negative debt when the scheduler can't figure out why it's not able to catch up that .1% on other projects. My workaround so far is working near perfect for me. I'm losing about 2% CPU time when the manager can't figure out what to do and I end up with 3 CPU apps and MW running, but the projects are all running now, all queuing work, and MW isn't running dry or hanging up.

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The fact that I am having no problems with debt must be because I only run 2 projects on my computers.

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I've done all that numerous time, you shouldn't have to do it though. I have Milkyway set to run 99.20% of the time on my i7 yet if I didn't constantly coax it into running more MWay Wu's the ATI Cards would sit Idle 1/2 the day or more ...

Right now I've just stopped running anything but the ATI Cards on those Box's, the CPU's can sit Idle if that's what it takes to keep the ATI Cards running.

I didn't invest the Money I did in the ATI Cards with more coming to just see them sit Idle because their waiting to run ...

Done all what numerous times? If you're reseting debt you have to do it hourly to keep up with the project. It's not a one time fix, it's something you have to do constantly in order to keep the project going. And no, you shouldn't have to do it, but that's the BOINC managers fault not MWs. The app is GPU but not CUDA, the manager doesn't understand any GPU apps but CUDA, therefore it schedules it like a CPU app. The fact it runs all the time despite the CPU not being used constantly digs itself further into "negative" debt, i.e. telling the manager to schedule the other projects before it.

My system with just a single OEM spec 512MB HD4870 ran itself to -18000 debt in just a few days and wouldn't run MW work at all because it was waiting for the other projects to "catch up."

As for 99% that doesn't matter, because it's going to run 100% of the time and constantly dig itself into negative debt when the scheduler can't figure out why it's not able to catch up that .1% on other projects. My workaround so far is working near perfect for me. I'm losing about 2% CPU time when the manager can't figure out what to do and I end up with 3 CPU apps and MW running, but the projects are all running now, all queuing work, and MW isn't running dry or hanging up.

The only work around I can see that you have is to reset the Project 24 Times a day

If you're reseting debt you have to do it hourly to keep up with the project. It's not a one time fix, it's something you have to do constantly in order to keep the project going

Sounds good to me, I'll get a 24 Hour Alarm Clock. one that goes off 24 Times a day automatically so I can reset the Project 24 Times a day. Rather than do that I'll just run MWay by itself on those Box's first, I'll get a lot more sleep that way.

I tried something last night before I went to bed, I have a little Script that restricts how many Wu's from 1 Project can be running according to what I set it at. Anyhow I set it to only allow only 6 PrimeGrid Wu's to be running @ one time on my i7, so that left 2 Cores open for the Milkyway Project.

Well that didn't work either, going back through the stdoutdae.txt in the BOINC Directory this morning there is a 2 hour Gap where there are no entries for Milkyway & then you can see where the Project Wu's were resumed again. So that means 3 Cores sat doing nothing for 2 Hours rather than BOINC using them to run the Milkyway Wu's.

The fact that I am having no problems with debt must be because I only run 2 projects on my computers.

That's all I run too, 2 Projects at a time on the ATI Card Box's, Milkyway & 1 other Project.

Why not use a script to reset the debt to 0.000000 on an hourly basis. I think I saw a post in some thread suggesting something like that.

It could be based on the script to tickle the Update button, but target the [b]client_state file section - <long_term_debt>0.000000</long_term_debt> -

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Go away, I was asleep

I only have the 4830 in my quad core and it keeps up just fine with a 850-Seti/150-Milkyway setting.

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Why not use a script to reset the debt to 0.000000 on an hourly basis. I think I saw a post in some thread suggesting something like that.

It could be based on the script to tickle the Update button, but target the [b]client_state file section - <long_term_debt>0.000000</long_term_debt> -

Why not make us that Script John, then we could all can use it ... ;)

Uhm, I DID make it a script. You really think I manually reset it hourly? LOL. Sorry I wasn't clear about that part, I just assumed nobody would want to babysit it that much and would figure out a way around it. My fault. :-) So, here's the fix:

Here's my "script," you can name it whatever you want, mine is MWDebt.cmd

Save it in your BOINC manager directory.

D:
CD "D:\Program Files\BOINC"
boinccmd --set_debts http://milkyway.cs.rpi.edu/milkyway 0 500

Change "D:" to whatever drive your BOINC manager is installed on. Do not skip this step.

Change "D:\Program Files\BOINC" to the location of your manager, not the projects! Do not skip this step.

The 0 is short-term debt, the 500 is long-term debt. I used 0 0 for awhile but it seems to dig itself into a hole too fast. I've been playing with the values a little bit to see if it makes things more predictable.

On Windows, go to Control Panel, Administrative Tools, Task Scheduler. Create a new task to run the .cmd file you made (i.e. MWDebt.cmd). Make it trigger once a day and then run every hour. Haven't looked into how to do that on any OS but Windows 7 yet (I have, just a long time ago), but I'm sure Vista has very similar options. You could also just make it run every hour, it's just that Win 7 has a specific "repeat every" option that makes it even easier to just have it trigger once and repeat every hour hehe.

The reason you shouldn't skip the drive and directory steps is that the default BOINC Manager security will only allow boinccmd when run in the same context as the manager (i.e. same path). If you run it from another path it will require user credentials, which unless you've setup remote access is going to be some huge random string of letters and numbers.

If you need more help setting this up to try just let me know.

Edit: Just changed my debts to 0 short, 500 long after noticing the project stalling out again and at -1800 debt even with hourly debt resets. Sheesh!

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Okay JerWA I'll give that a try & Thanks,if you have no background in Programing or Software making Scripts is the last thing that comes to your mind so in my case I'd never figure it out.

Yesterday was a little better as I switched to a Project with longer running Wu's, that seemed to keep the ATI Cards running most of the day anyway.

I noticed the project has implemented a WU cap as well, as I'm getting pretty regular "No more work for you" messages that I wasn't before.

Seems to be running well now, for the most part. Unfortunately it does not recover from any unexpected changes, so that's always an automatic required manual intervention. This is as much (or more?) about the Manager 6.4.7 as it is MW.

For instance my home network lost Internet access for most of the day yesterday. Since MW will only queue about 20 minutes of work at max (and rarely keeps the queue that deep) it promptly ran dry and just sat there all day. When my Internet connection was restored, MW ran fine, but the weird debts caused by the lack of access made the manager run only 3 CPU tasks no matter what else was running (I think because it was trying to fill MW debt for a change). Had to exit and restart the manager then it fixed itself.

Also noticed that one of my projects that was running fine for awhile has now fallen on its head. Checked the client state file and that project is sitting at something wild like -138000 debt now. No clue why. Ah well, guess it needed a break hehe. As long as all 4 CPUs are churning and MW is keeping the GPU fires lit I'll let it figure itself out. And that's mostly what I've accomplished with my weird, tangled, overly complex setup. So until they release a better manager and/or just give us back control over our own resources I'll leave it be.

PS: I forgot to mention, the "script" is just a plain text file. Use notepad to create it, as Wordpad will probably leave weird formatting that may cause problems. You can right-click make new Text file, then just rename it .cmd after you edit it.

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JerWA, the Script works in that it does Automatically Reset the Debt's but it didn't solve the Problem of me trying to run the PrimeGrid 321 Sieve Wu's along side the Milkyway ATI Wu's. I set the Debt Script up on 1 ATI Box and Manually ran it a few times & checked the client_state.xml file to see if the Debts had been changed & each time they were at 0 & 500 so that parts good.

Then I started Prime Grid back up again & Downloaded 12 or so Wu's & as soon as I did & 4 of them started running every Milkyway Wu went into a waiting to run State even with the Debts reset. So I exited BOINC & used BOINC Debt Viewer to Reset all the Projects Debts on that Box & then Restarted BOPINC again.

Same thing, 4 PrimeGrid Wu's started up but all the Milkyway Wu's stayed in a waiting to run state. So I Suspended PrimeGrid & Resumed a lone AQUA MT Wu which uses 2.68 CPU's to run & the Milkyway Wu's started back up again with 3 running. Something about the PG 321 Sieve Wu's that just don't want to get along with the MW ATI Wu's where both will run together peacefully. They will run together but after just a short while most times the MW Wu's go into the waiting to run mode ...

PS: That Cap has been in place for quite awhile, I think it's 24 for a Quad Core CPU and 48 for the i7's, basically it's 6 Per Core whatever you have I guess. But most times I find your doing good if you actually have your allotted amount for the amount of Cores you have.

PoorBoy I think I remember you mentioning that you've got MW on a low resource share, right? My script will fix the debts, but then the manager is going to try to schedule it like a CPU app which means it's competing for resources it doesn't actually need. Set the project resources higher than your other stuff so that the manager will want it to be running more often. It's still going to dig itself into a credit debt problem, but at least it will keep running until the next time the script fixes debts hehe.

All of my projects are at the default 100 resource share, MW is at 190 now (also tweaking it to find the sweet spot where it doesn't drop to 3 CPU apps).

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PoorBoy I think I remember you mentioning that you've got MW on a low resource share, right[quote]

No, Milkyway is and always has been set at a 50% or higher Resource Share when ever I run the Project. I've been around the Projects long enough to know you have to set the Projects you want to run more at a higher percentage than the other Project or Projects your running.

[quote](also tweaking it to find the sweet spot where it doesn't drop to 3 CPU apps).

For a long time I ram PrimeGrid (The Sieve Wu's) along side the ATI Wu's with no problems, day in & day out 4 PrimeGrid Wu's ran alongside 3 Milkyway ATI Wu's. Then all of a sudden about a week ago things changed, I didn't change anything myself but the Milkyway Wu's just started going into the "waiting to run" mode. I was running the same BOINC Client & Video Driver's that I always had been & hadn't done any other Updates to the OS.

So that's what I can't understand why now all of a sudden I'm having these problems keeping the Milkyway Wu's running short of just running it all by it's self & forgoing running the CPU Wu's at all. It's not just 1 Box but all 6 Box's that I have a ATI GPU Capable Card in. The only thing I can think of is that the Wu's have changed somehow to where they don't want to run right on my Systems.

If I had to guess it's project debt. The MW vs BOINC Manager fight affects every project. You cannot change debts without it impacting all other projects on a machine. And since the manager is trying to schedule it against CPU time that it isn't using things get wonky.

Since I started MW these are all the new and interesting things I've seen BOINC do (after running for 3 days w/o a single glitch when I first joined):

- Stop requesting work for unrelated projects (caused by: debt for that project jumping to a negative six digit number despite all other projects still having normal debt #'s)

- Stop running anything on 1 core of my 4 core CPU (caused by: suspect it's debt again, as the manager tries to "make up" debt to MW by giving it CPU time it doesn't want, which is why I say it's a balancing act)

- Estimate MW work units at everything from 40 seconds to 32 minutes to completion (wish I knew the cause, happens once every 24-32 hours or so)

- Decide that 2 day queue = 2 WUs, or 4, or maybe 8, or every WU it will let me have, in no particular order, and constantly changing minute to minute (doesn't bug me overly much but MAN does it spam the MW server a lot... my machine = Created 22 Jun 2009 13:19:56 UTC, Number of times client has contacted server 6961)

- Mark MW work as running that isn't getting any resources (think that was a CAL failure)

- Change from a 60-minutes-per-project cycle to a 2-seconds-per-project cycle, fixable only by restarting the manager

I suspect that the majority of the weirdness is the fact that BOINC Manager sees MW as a CPU app and tries to schedule it accordingly. Meanwhile, actual CPU apps are using all of your CPU time. Therefore you have projects picking up and losing more "total" debt than can be accounted for in the amount of time it's running. Even worse, the MW GPU app DOES use some CPU time, just relatively little, so CPU apps get shorted a few seconds too. It's a mess, but it sure is fun. :-)

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I may have stumbled upon some better Application Settings that allow shorter running Wu's to co-exist alongside the really short running Milkyway ATI Wu's. So far for the last 10 hours or so they have worked without the ATI Milkyway Wu's going into the "waiting to run mode" but I'm going to wait until tomorrow morning to Post them to make sure they continue to work.

Right now and they have been for the last 10 hours like I said they've been running 4 SIMAP & 3 or 6 Milkyway Wu's depending on the set up on the Quads & 8 SIMAP & 6 Milkyway ATI Wu's on my i7 with 2 Single Core ATI Cards. So the Box's are running like they should without any interference on my part other than to use the settings I stumbled on ... :)